Jehovah's Witnesses Vandalized Our Deck!

Hmmmm,sounds like possible mistaken identity could be Mormon missionaries?
Anyhow both groups are intrusive and cold call just as badly.

Dissident JW member speaks out.

The core dogma of the Watchtower organization is that Jesus had his second coming 'invisibly' in the year 1914.Their entire doctrinal superstructure is built on this falsehood.

Jehovah's Witnesses door to door recruitment is by their own admission an ineffective tactic. They have lost membership in all countries with major Internet access because their false doctrines and harmful practices are exposed on the modern information superhighway.

There is good and valid reasons why there is such an outrage against the Watchtower for misleading millions of followers.Many have invested everything in the 'imminent' apocalyptic promises of the Jehovah's Witnesses and have died broken and beaten.

---
Respectfully,Danny Haszard http://www.freeminds.org

Tell the truth don't be afraid

“You’ll never get sick. You will never grow old. And you will never die.”

Although the above words come from the movie “Cocoon,” they could have come from the Watchtower Society because this is the same thing they have been proclaiming for decades as part of “the Creator’s promise of a peaceful and secure new world that is about to replace the present wicked lawless system of things.”

This very appealing prospect attracts many people to begin to study the Bible with Jehovah’s Witnesses. It then sustains them as they eagerly wait for the fulfillment of this promise.

But during the course of their study they get drawn into an illusionary concept involving the Watchtower organization that gradually takes over their decision-making process and even their conscience without them realizing it. It happens because of a mistake that everyone makes before they decide to become a Jehovah’s Witness.

“Captives of a Concept” identifies both the concept and the mistake that causes people to become captives of it. The book also offers suggestions that may help some Jehovah’s Witnesses correct their mistake and teach themselves the truth about their religion.

www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com

The literature they left behind is JW. Despite the Jesus icon, you know? He's got perfectly groomed hair minus the hippy look, shining white teeth, and for a dark-haired guy, he doesn't look Hispanic, Arabic(certainly not Palestinian), Asian, etc. Anyway, It says Jehovah's Witness in the flyer and has www.watchtower.org printed on it. Kinda strange how there is no local contact information?

Their name, "Elder" as both men introduced themselves to my mother has to do with a custom. It's not a first name but the equivalent of the masculine prefix "Mister" or "Mr." as we would use in normal, every day, good ol' fashioned Minnesotan and anywhere else in the English speaking world. Now, whether or not it's indicative of Mormon or JW faith, I don't know. Maybe it's a cult that has crossed over from one to the other.

The truth is, I could go stand outside in my yard for a day or week, and I'd probably be really bored after a while. Put an elderly lady with a brain injury out there like my mom and they start coming around. Even all the time I've spent outside with her; they see me out there and keep moving. -And that upsets me because it makes me think they're preying on her. So, they probably wait for my car to be out of the driveway (while I'm at work) or something like that.

Hmm... Strange on many counts. I'm an EX-witness, but I wouldn't want them to be blamed for something they didn't actually do. (There's plenty of valid criticism for this dangerous cult.)

Nothing PREVENTS them from riding bikes if they should choose, nor of wearing black slacks and white shirts should they choose. However, because this is so closely identified with the Mormon "uniform" that the 20-year-old LDS kids classically wear, I can't imagine a couple of legitimate JW preachers actually presenting themselves that way.

Also, nothing prevents anyone who receives one of their "follow Jesus by following the Watchtower" tracts (yes, yes, I've paraphrased it to represent its underlying message) from passing it along to someone else.

So, ANYONE could put these elements together in a strange attempt to go harrass some poor little old lady. That's actually my opinion of what's happened here. Lots of people don't see any difference between Mormons and JWs. It could be sort of a costume they made up.

Too bad your mom is the victim. I hope you can get to the bottom of it.

Meanwhile, if you want to rant against the JWs, you can find out good, solid reasons to do so by looking at these links:

http://ajwrb.org/
http://jwfacts.com/
http://freeminds.org
http://silentlambs.org

Okay, let's go over this again....

The way my mother has explained it, these yahoos were coming around in the evening for about the last six weeks or so. And according to her, they would initiate a religious debate (Now, what that exactly means, I don't know...as far as details). from what she recalls, the debates became out of hand, argumentative, and she would ask them to leave.

The thing people must understand, is my mother suffers from TBI (Traumatic Brain Injury) and one of the things she has problems with is certain kinds of memory like short term. So, as a caretaker; the forgets to tell me about instances like this.

One more time, whether these guys were selling Tupperware, steamrollers, beaver pelts, or Baby Jesus is a box....It doesn't matter...I'm just going by what she said, and that stupid pamphlet they shoved in the door. My mom is pretty sure it's these same punks who have been coming around when I'm not there. And now where are they, it's been almost a week?

So I have called the local Kingdom Hall and it's like they're scanning their messages. Nobody ever answers the phone....Gee whiskers, imagine that? This whole thing is spooky and knowing this kind of activity can happen in downtown shakopee 100 feet away from the Government Center really bothers me.

It's very disrespectful and it will be a cold day in hell before I let some malicious bible-thumpers try to intimidate my family. I guess I'll have to spend more time being the scarecrow outside keeping the vultures away...

One more thing...

I spent a large part of my undergraduate studies for one of my degrees in World Religions. I am fairly familiar and tolerant of different cultures. I've even had the opportunity on a huge scholarship to travel one month in Norway and spend two (2) years studying in southern France at L'universite de Marseilles.

It's not my prerogative to point fingers and blame a particular religion or cult because of what occurred. This was a situation between my mother and two 20-something males that had been boiling for some time and I was never aware of. If it can happen to me and my mother, it can happen to anyone. Who knows, it could be just two guys smoking the wrong stuff and nothing better to do. Or, they could be affiliated with anything. I'm just going by what my mother says happend...

My main concern is beware of this kind of activity...It's the time of year when it's great to be outside enjoying the weather and whether you may know it or not, you might be making yourself a target or opportunity.

"These Yahoos coming around in the evenings for the past 6 weeks" is definitly not a JW tactic. Again i emphasise the description of "Elder and elder , on bikes , uniform" etc is a Mormon description. Whether they were legit or not is for you to determine. But they were not JW's so please refrain pointing the blame at them in this forum. I would suggest you contact the Mormons to see if they were working in that area, and if not - then it is more likely imposters.

Okay, we are going to nip this in the bud right now! Enough is enough. I don’t think this forum is ment to be used for this manner. If you have been insulted by my son’s words, I am sorry. As I read though his postings I see the anger he feels towards anyone bringing me harm. And he is conveying this anger through his words…..albeit sometimes miswritten words.

The facts are: (and this is from the horse’s mouth)
• Yes, I have a brain injury……but I am not stupid
• I am regularly contacted at my home by JW and Mormons. Do I feel targeted because I have shared my beliefs? Yes. The young men that my son alluded to have stopped many times and have been friendly. (they even offered to help me in my garden) The JWs that have stopped have been just as cordial. Some of my friends are JW. I love talking to anyone walking by my home. Just not about religion.
• Last week someone came up on my deck and pushed garden decorations/tools on the table onto the deck floor. (no, it was not the wind or an animal)
• After finding the mess on the floor….I found a Watchtower in the back door.
• I told to my son that I was feeling targeted by those who want to see me “saved” and how upsetting it is when that friendly face tries converting my beliefs. It gets old after a while.
• My son called the police to find out how to keep this from happening. The policeman gave us a sticker for the window. This sticker is to keep anyone selling anything from approaching the door. Except JWs. If you want them to leave you alone you need to post the words NO PROSELYTIZERS.

So, that is that. Say no more.

ndouglasIm not interested and will not be drawn into a long debate with you as i said before im not into exercises in futility. You assumed it was the JWs before you had any REAL reason to believe that was the case. As I said no witness to said act, no evidence pointing to JWs commiting the act and no motive for the JWs to go around kicking flower pots over. But mostly everyone on here recognizes that there's no factual evidence pointing to the Witnesses, just the inane ramblings of one blogger

wilbursgirl
i dont have a problem with one trying to protect their mother. Its an admirable quality, however when you have NO PROOF that JW's committes this crime, but still spew the vitriolic statements that he did then i have an issue with that. The crime could have been committed by some neighborhood yahoos(likely) or Mormons, Mailman, JW(less likely) or any other imbecile passing by (likely)...however JW's have been singled out as the guilty party...yada yada yada.

I never said he didnt have the right to call the police, i mean thats their job but even then your story should have some solid factual backing.

Make no mistake Im sorry that the womans property was vandalized. But yeah i am more upset with (likely) false accusations being launched forth against my religion. Its alot easier to clean up one's property than it is to clean up damage done to a person/organizations image/reputation because of a false accusation.

And as far as JW's continuing to work your home after you've asked them to not return. IF that is happening its unfortunate. The organization and the Service Overseer's are usually good about making sure that those things don't happen. Usually if JW's work a house that's supposed to be a "do not return" its an oversight on the duo working the house. Or Overseers are checking to see if circumstances have changed at that home. (and that's no Amish fairytale).

But im done with this lame "witch hunt", so do and say what you feel. Its just unfortunate that people actually believe most of the things they read, b/c somewhere someone is reading this and getting the wrong idea about JWs.....:(

Why not an animal?

After reading the entire exchange, I am convinced that "ndouglas" has no evidence whatever to support his accusation. He is so eager to jump to conclusions that he merges, in his mind, the two groups who had been visiting his mother and blames them both! Imagine that -- the Mormons and the Jehovah's Witnesses conspiring together to commit vandalism!

In my opinion, the most relevant comment comes indeed from "the horse's mouth." "jcdoug" wrote, in part,

= = =
• Last week someone came up on my deck and pushed garden decorations/tools on the table onto the deck floor. (no, it was not the wind or an animal)
• After finding the mess on the floor….I found a Watchtower in the back door.
• I told to my son that I was feeling targeted by those who want to see me “saved” and how upsetting it is when that friendly face tries converting my beliefs. It gets old after a while.
= = =

So the suspicion that the vandalism came from one of the "friendly faces" arose in her mind when she found the pamphlet in the back door.

Here's an equally plausible scenario. Why not an animal? In a surprising coincidence, last week "someone" pushed over a large potted plant on our deck, uprooted the plant, and scattered the potting soil all around. My wife immediately suspected one of the grandchildren who had been visiting that afternoon, but I had gone out on the deck after they had left and seen nothing amiss. She repotted the plant and cleaned up, and the next evening I watched a large raccoon come on the deck and tip the plant over again!

When I confronted it, it gave me a disgusted look and sauntered slowly away, as if I had the nerve to interfere with its right to forage! (It neglected to leave any religious literature, but no doubt I'll soon be hearing from PETA.)

Whether or not the "vandalism" was by wind, animal, or a mean person, it is highly doubtful that the vandal would have left the pamphlet.

More likely, the Jehovah's Witnesses came to the porch after the vandalism occurred, saw that the front door was blocked by debris, and went around to the back to leave their literature, thereby setting themselves up for the blame.

Tracy Hall Jr
Provo Canyon, Utah
hthalljr'gmail'com

Enough all of you.

Jehovah' Witness you don't know anything about Morman's either.

Elder is use in my church for those men in charge. Different from a deacon or a trustee.

Funny how you all want tolerance but its on sided.

Enough already. The man was protecting his mom. Circumstantial evidence or whatever.

Give it a rest.

P.S. to Username -- quoting you "And as far as JW's continuing to work your home after you've asked them to not return. IF that is happening its unfortunate. The organization and the Service Overseer's are usually good about making sure that those things don't happen. Usually if JW's work a house that's supposed to be a "do not return" its an oversight on the duo working the house. Or Overseers are checking to see if circumstances have changed at that home. (and that's no Amish fairytale)."

They do come and return after repeated calls to stop.

Have you ever lived around Amish, I have (along with Brethern, Mennonites, Dunkards). So what is with the comment?

Username, thank you for the apology. I will contact the overseer the next time I receive unsolicited information.

Can this be put to rest now?

IF you have a moment, check out this link of a lady talking about protecting yourself and family because criminals have been reported tazering and robbing residents at their door under the pretense of proselytizing.

Title: Watch out for tazer toting bible thumpers
Link: http://youtube.com/watch?v=3nQVtZy7HTw

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh:
Both JWs and Mormons employ the same mind control over their victims, I've seen it first hand.
Both require victims to obey leaders unquestionably.
Both require victims to accept work assignments (door to door selling, etc).
Both will not allow a member to leave without some kangeroo tribunal held to 'convict' the 'apostate'.
Once a victim joins he can't leave easily because they have their family brainwashed too.
People that do leave are 'shunned' - they often lose their spouses, kids, friends, uncles and aunts and cousins etc.
Both suffer under heavy handed rules: For Mormons; No tea, no coffee, no coca cola, no excessive laughing (I'm not making this up), they're held to dress codes and are expected to toe the line or face disciplinary action.
For JWs it's no better; No birthdays, no Christmas, no Flag Day, no Labor Day, no singing the National Anthem, no saluting the flag, and worse than all, they are forbidden from blood transfusions, misinterpreting an Old Testament passage about *eating blood*.
You get the idea.
Best just to stay far far away.

Rdouglas, here's a tip - Take a course in critical thinking.

Sorry to hear about your mom - but you have no witnesses, no evidence, nothing to implicate the JW's. Just a random brochure and someone who said they saw some mormons.
If your mom is truly in bad shape, you should consider a home.

And seriously, if you want to talk about scam religions, here's a recommendation - let's talk about the one that produced the inquisition, hid the bible from it's members for centuries and has a rich history of deviant clergy - from popes to local priests.

Or we could talk about the one a king founded because he couldn't get a divorce.

Or the ones that call themselves christian but are re-writing the bible to accept gay and lesbian priests and bishops.

Or the ones that encourage their members to strap on bombs and go into marketplaces and blow people up.

Theres an abundance of scam religions around, including many of the most "popular" ones. Do a little research and I'm sure you can be just as disgusted as I am by the scam religions.

Maybe you can get your tuition money back and use it on a logic course.

Those were Mormons. Period. If you had paid attention in class you would know that the young men are required to spend two years in missionary work in order to advance in the organization. Moreover you would know that they are limited to bicycles and that they proselytize in their shirt sleeves. JW's wear suits of various (businesslike) designs and, except in the hottest of weather, do not remove their jackets. JW's will nearly alway speak directly from the Bible and Mormons will seldom, if ever, have one in their possession. How could you take such a course and not have even this sketchy information about the two fastest growing religions in America?

You do not know WHO kicked the pots over ... could have been a dog chasing a raccoon, fer cryin' out loud. Nor do you know when that tract was placed.

All you know is that your Mom has a serious brain injury, that a tract was found in the door, that two young men on bicycles (get off the fixation -- they were NOT JW's!) had stopped by several times and that the pots were knocked over in your absence.

What you don't know is if ANY two of these events are connected. Chill out on the anger. Go ask the Mormons not to call on you again and do the same with the next JW you see. You are in serious danger of letting your ill-defined and poorly targeted anger lead you straight to jail.

If you -really- want to go "Nate in the Temple" ... go find a temple. The JW's are some of the mildest people you will ever find ... they did not vandalize your deck.

I think it's friggin' hilarious people are still ******ing and moaning over all this! It's been how long?

GET OVER IT!!!

So what? A couple of morons were trying to proselytize, picking on my mother and trashed our property. I feel sorry for them because it's most likely these young men didn't even realize their actions. Oh well, I still think Mormon and JWs faith is a fraud and serves no purpose in Christianity. I feel sorry for anyone involved in these cults.